Sign in Join

Live chat for Free Pascal, Lazarus, Delphi and every Pascal programmer.

Mailing lists / fpc-other / 2023-04

Re: fpc-other Digest, Vol 150, Issue 8

4 messages · 4 people · –

Reply by email Subscribe to this list Your subscription

Read-only archive. Use j and k to move between messages.

HSN

Hi Graemeg thanks for visiting. I wish you had seen the topic which explains how to get in the invite list without an email. I’m sorry about that.

I’m very disappointed in the crazy talk I’ve found in here. Since when is it ok for some stranger who has absolutely nothing to do with #fpc channel to come along and demand ownership of our channel that we use talk about our fpc coding everyday? This is insanity. He has no business there besides to cause trouble. I see no evidence that he even programs in pascal. He has his own channel is he jealous that he can’t get members or something? I don’t know. Why would anyone take this person seriously? I don’t want to associate with anyone who takes him seriously I’ll tell you that.

I hope the people lurking are more sensible than some of the people talking in here. If anyone wants to be part of a nice fpc community in irc where trolls and Spybots are not allowed Please come join us in #fpc on Libera. If our channel gets hijacked don’t worry I will help you find where we moved to and make The new channel even better.

I have come here and given all the information needed for intelligent people to decide if joining an irc channel run by me is a good option for them or not. If the People in channel were not happy with me they would have left a long time ago. They aren’t hostages you know!

See you in irc or forums I’m done with this mailing list. Thank you for reading and have a nice day :)

Show quoted text 229 lines
Send fpc-other mailing list submissions to To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://lists.freepascal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fpc-other or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to You can reach the person managing the list at When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of fpc-other digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: #fpc irc channel (Johannes Truschnigg) 2. Re: fpc-other Digest, Vol 150, Issue 6 (Steve Litt) 3. Re: Why #fpc matters (Ralf Quint) 4. Rescue #fpc: was fpc-other Digest, Vol 150, Issue 6 (Steve Litt) 5. Re: #fpc irc channel (Graeme Geldenhuys) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2023 21:36:47 +0200 From: Johannes Truschnigg To: Subject: Re: [fpc-other] #fpc irc channel Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dear fpc-other list members, I've only just now subscribed to this list and had to reconstruct a number of headers from pipermail-provided HTML - nevertheless, I hope this message will slot into the proper thread concerning IRC channel woes. Even though similar complaints on the official Lazarus forums have not led to a noticeable outcome for the IRC channels concerned there, I would like to direct your attention to my personal attempt at raising this issue there earlier this year: https://forum.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/topic,62584.0.html Lazarus forum moderators have banned all discussion involving IRC on their platform as the (somewhat understandable) consequence of a number of users independently raising this issue during recent months. If you take the time to review and reflect on the actions taken by Joanna on channels under her control on libera.chat, I believe you will arrive at the conclusion that her interpretation of the role as a channel's steward and all-powerful operator can only be perceived as detrimental to any positive and inclusive form of community one could hope to foster in such a setting. Thank you for your time, attention and consideration. -- with best regards: - Johannes Truschnigg -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 833 bytes Desc: not available URL: <http://lists.freepascal.org/pipermail/fpc-other/attachments/20230421/9d517a3f/attachment-0001.sig> ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2023 16:36:15 -0400 From: Steve Litt To: Subject: Re: [fpc-other] fpc-other Digest, Vol 150, Issue 6 Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII HSN via fpc-other said on Fri, 21 Apr 2023 10:14:56 +0000 >The ban list for #fpc can be accessed by typing /mode #fpc b >I hereby relinquish all claims to said list donate it to whomever >wishes to recruit new members for their own channel. I think the official FPC project should register #fpc FAST! We want #FPC conforming to the project's agenda, not to some individual agenda. SteveT Steve Litt Autumn 2022 featured book: Thriving in Tough Times http://www.troubleshooters.com/bookstore/thrive.htm ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2023 13:38:22 -0700 From: Ralf Quint To: Subject: Re: [fpc-other] Why #fpc matters Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed" On 4/20/2023 11:33 PM, HSN via fpc-other wrote: > > Hello everyone this is Joanna > That was obvious... > > I discovered fpc and Lazarus around 2014. Before that I was involved > with online gaming and programming bots. > That explains a lot... (And just for the record, I am using Free Pascal since at least 1997, when it was still "just" a 386 code producing clone of Turbo Pascal and still named FPK (Florian's Pascal Kompiler, IIRC the first copyright statements back in those days) ... I don't care personally for any IRC channel (nor Discord, Slack, or anything along those lines), but it seems that you have taken a very dictatorial and oppressive view and thus actions on the IRC channel, which seem to be rather detrimental and contrary to your stated intention of "promoting FPC"... For example, a lot of people might just be "lurking", simply because they are new to (Free)Pascal, as well as not being able to speak and properly write in English, because it is not their native language. You are excluding and downright chastise those people for being newbies. Not very inclusive and inviting... Beside that people might not be able to tell you what they are working on, as there simply might not be a specific project, as they just might wanna work. But this is for you apparently just another reason to slap them in the face and ban them. Bottom line is that it is YOU who is "orchestrating drama" and you don't seem to grasp that your actions are in effect malicious to anyone in the project, be it developers or users. Ralf -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.freepascal.org/pipermail/fpc-other/attachments/20230421/97aceada/attachment-0001.htm> ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2023 19:52:26 -0400 From: Steve Litt To: Subject: [fpc-other] Rescue #fpc: was fpc-other Digest, Vol 150, Issue 6 Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII HSN via fpc-other said on Fri, 21 Apr 2023 10:14:56 +0000 >The ban list for #fpc can be accessed by typing /mode #fpc b I had no idea the situation was as bad as it is until I ran the preceding command. #fpc has banned 53 people, 43 of whom were banned by Joanna. This is more people banned than any of #c, #linux, #windows, #systemd, #html, or #pascal. >I hereby relinquish all claims to said list donate it to whomever >wishes to recruit new members for their own channel. This is a step in the right direction. Thank you Joanna. Tomas (Hajny), I beg you, please step in and take temporary control of #fpc until the project itself can take control. If #fpc is left for just anybody to register, things could go from bad to worse. I'd do it myself, except as a banned individual I can't register a channel I'm banned from. I'll be glad to help you. And please ASAP unban those 52 people, or at least the 43 banned by Joanna. Thanks, SteveT Steve Litt Autumn 2022 featured book: Thriving in Tough Times http://www.troubleshooters.com/bookstore/thrive.htm ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2023 09:38:19 +0000 From: Graeme Geldenhuys To: Subject: Re: [fpc-other] #fpc irc channel Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 On 4/20/23 15:03, HSN via fpc-other wrote: > Irc is one of the few platforms left on the Internet where there is no phone number or email required to talk. Yet, I had to enter a valid email address to register for the #fpc IRC channel, and confirm its valid. So there goes that theory of yours. :-) My preference is still good old NNTP (newsgroups). * Doesn't require registration * Doesn't require a valid email address * Users are free to use any News Client they prefer, with the feature they want/need. * History of conversations can be stored forever - no loss of information (the internet is fragile enough already) * Past messages are searchable (an ever growing knowledge base) Hence I've been hosting newsgroups for some open source projects for well over a decade now. Regards, Graeme ------------------------------ Subject: Digest Footer _______________________________________________ fpc-other maillist - https://lists.freepascal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fpc-other ------------------------------ End of fpc-other Digest, Vol 150, Issue 8 *****************************************

Reply by email

Alexander Stohr
to HSN
HSN wrote
Hi Graemeg thanks for visiting. I wish you had seen the topic which explains how to get in the invite list without an email. I’m sorry about that.

This line does not resolve any sort of a certain problem - and even if it would (but it does not), it would only apply to the named single person.

I’m very disappointed in the crazy talk I’ve found in here.

That does not buy anything. It expresses some sort of personal feeling. Its neither an apology nor a promise to improve anything at all.

Since when is it ok for some stranger who has absolutely nothing to do with #fpc channel to come along and demand ownership of our channel that we use talk about our fpc coding everyday?

The internet is full of strangers - and as long as its reasonable to a degree to assume its a true human, you should treat it as a human. period. Dont ask others - ask yourself. If you already need the opinion of others about humanity and human acting, then you give me the feeling you are having an obvious deficit in that respect.

Dont do rabulistics, dont do rethorics. Stay for yourself. A good reputation is something that you have to work for as long as your life lasts. I feel you are expecting those channel your buddy club for nice talk, like young people at high school might sometimes have. Later life is a social skills level more advanced than those age stage i mentioned just before.

This is insanity. He has no business there besides to cause trouble. I see no evidence that he even programs in pascal. He has his own channel is he jealous that he can’t get members or something? I don’t know.

Feelings again. To me it sounds even more paranoia than i have found in the previous discussions.
Fact driven decisions would be what a moderation task in an open system would require to carry out. Giving good proof of such facts would pull you out of the problem - but no visible efforts to me you even want to try that. That gives me the impression, that you cant because you dont have. Why go the way asking others, whilst having all good reason in your hand? Because you dont have...!?!
(Side node: A closed system has a different rule set. There you can have a gatekeeper role - there you can check IDs, there you can claim its 'your club'. IRC is open. Period.)

Why would anyone take this person seriously? I don’t want to associate with anyone who takes him seriously I’ll tell you that.

You dont want to put any cent of efforts in cooperation? It seems to be a fixed pattern for you to NOT cooperate, to not explore further, to close the lids instead, to kick people off that you feel(!) bothered in some way. Yes, the steady stream of new people joining an IRC channel is a burden, a load, something that will try to "depress" you. Either you can stand it, or you cant. Again said, its an open system by its current design and setup - because its purpose demands it. The question is, why are the others getting evicted when just speaking up - but not even the idea of you being the single point of problem gets a single sentence of discussion, of serious thought. What shall i say? You are going to ask why others would take a person seriously. Because they do something that you are looking to be not capable of. And now... anyone shall follow that your in-ability... - well it sounds like you cannot... you can not cope with people in a way needed to go for an admin job.

Show quoted text 6 lines
I hope the people lurking are more sensible than some of the people talking in here. If anyone wants to be part of a nice fpc community in irc where trolls and Spybots are not allowed Please come join us in #fpc on Libera. If our channel gets hijacked don’t worry I will help you find where we moved to and make The new channel even better.

Lurkers are the silent people - so you are sort of claiming the silent people to be on /your side/. Something like "i have the silent majority on my side" is the BS that i found in Q-Anon circles by the dozend - but it violates any sane logic. Thats nothing but a pure rhetoric's non-honest trick and strategy, again. Its just filling some characters in - with no have lost the point - you need the active people on your side. But i cant see any valid efforts from your side to convince, to provide proof, to put anything on the desk that would clean up the raised subject. Instead i see you flee to some sort of a future - whilst the struggle of today is just forgotten. - Nope, the topic was about how to clean up. You don't contribute anything at all to that.

Instead your lines to read like, if anything goes wrong, and you probably have strong reasons to assume something like that, then you will be over there. That's advertisement of a concurrent media. So you are already claiming your self to be guilty enough to be in such needs. Okay, if you want to tell the world you are guilty. Why not undertake a clear hand-over step now? Reminder: a good reputation is something you have to work for a life span. Its up to you to have this part of your life gained a +/-0 instead of a -2 rating.

Show quoted text 5 lines
I have come here and given all the information needed for intelligent people to decide if joining an irc channel run by me is a good option for them or not. If the People in channel were not  happy with me they would have left a long time ago. They aren’t hostages you know!

I have read all notices - and sorry, there was nothing that would qualify as information needed. Sorry, that you are now indirectly calling all folks hear as insufficient intelligent. One more line of pure rhetoric from the hand book. Is joining an IRC channel run by you a good option? Its not the question of who is staying but its the topic of a bigger bunch of people having been excluded from the channel under circumstances that are strange to the people that spoke up here. Also statistics on the channel and also proof from other IRC system educated people show that there is something going on that is not at all a normal thing. Its not about the number of people that are happy but its the subject of people that are unhappy. Its about fixing what went wrong - instead of sitting on a heap of things that have not failed. Its about a culture like in coding where you can create a bug any time, but later have to find and fix it. You cant drive a business for long if your RMA is just kicking off the end users. - Yes again, its your rhetoric attempt to put a claim on a third party that is only a nearby but subject unrelated group. Nope, i feel shamed for you, as doing so is again not the right thing to go for - at least its nothing i would consider honest.

See you in irc or forums I’m done with this mailing list. Thank you for reading and have a nice day :)

Have fun wherever you want to go now.
Your decision is clear - feed the audience here with some rhetoric and admit nothing and neither clean up anything that you might have spilled. You are doing the wrong thing. Trust and confidence in your past and present actions wont be not created by that.

Your future will come for you - with that burden still on your back. Today was the right time and best chance to get it off - you simply missed that chance.

Reply by email

Tomas Hajny
to Alexander Stohr
Alexander Stohr wrote
Am 2023-04-22 um 19:55 schrieb HSN via fpc-other:

Hello Alexander,

.
.

> See you in irc or forums I’m done with this mailing list. Thank > you for reading and have a nice day :) Have fun wherever you want to go now.

.
.

Please note that Joanna unsubscribed from the mailing list right after having sent her last message you responded to. Obviously, she might read further responses in the mailing list archive or some other places (if she's interested in them - anybody may guess how much likely that is), but she wouldn't receive this response (or potentially other responses) directly.

Tomas
(one of FPC mailing list moderators)

Reply by email

Steve Litt
to Tomas Hajny

Tomas Hajny via fpc-other said on Mon, 24 Apr 2023 02:19:32 +0200

Show quoted text 20 lines
On 2023-04-24 01:56, Alexander Stohr via fpc-other wrote: > Am 2023-04-22 um 19:55 schrieb HSN via fpc-other: Hello Alexander, . . >> See you in irc or forums I’m done with this mailing list. Thank >> you for reading and have a nice day :) > Have fun wherever you want to go now. . . Please note that Joanna unsubscribed from the mailing list right after having sent her last message you responded to. Obviously, she might read further responses in the mailing list archive or some other places (if she's interested in them - anybody may guess how much likely that is), but she wouldn't receive this response (or potentially other responses) directly.

Discussion of the #fpc situation is also welcome on ##fpc-alt (note the two pound signs, which on Libre.Chat indicates "offtopic").

SteveT

Steve Litt
Autumn 2022 featured book: Thriving in Tough Times http://www.troubleshooters.com/bookstore/thrive.htm

Reply by email