I added a tuturial to compile and install FPC/Lazarus, from sources of SVN, on Windows.
Link: http://wiki.freepascal.org/Installing_Lazarus#Compiling.2Finstalling_FPC_and_Lazarus_from_Sources_of_SVN

Just my 2 cents... :)

Regards,
MD

I added a tuturial to compile and install FPC/Lazarus, from sources of SVN, on Windows. Link: http://wiki.freepascal.org/Installing_Lazarus#Compiling.2Finstalling_FPC_and_Lazarus_from_Sources_of_SVN

Thanks.
Maybe you should explain why you download wince, i386 and x86_64 sources, but you only compile a i386 compiler.

Mattias

When I got these URL's (by Dimitrios Chr. Ioannidis) here in the list, I wanted to keep all all these URL's... but I just compile FPC for i386.

I do not need wince and I need to study about x86_64 at first (I have one machine, but not tested yet).

So, what do you want?
Delete all information about wince and x86_64 or somebody will complete these informations?

Thanks,
MD

Hi,

this is a good thing but I think it won't work as described for 2 reasons.

1st: ppc386.exe isn't part of binutils and you don't describe how to get it but need it.(I don't know an easy way too - except installing fpc by installer)
2nd: IIRC it isn't possible to install fpc in the same directory as the source. (I always create a subdirectory called "src" or "source")

The rest seem to be ok. Good work!

regards,
Ingo

I want you to explain to the wiki readers, what each step does and why it is needed, and what to do when a step fails.

Delete all information about wince and x86_64 or somebody will complete these informations?

If the installation for windows 32bit and windows 64bit is different, then they should get two different sections in the wiki.

BTW,
At the moment we have two wiki pages about installing. Juha has started to clean up / update the 'Getting_Lazarus' page and put each target onto a page of its own, which IMO is better than putting every thing onto one page.
Eventually the other page should be removed and there should be only one left. Preferably it should be renamed to something with install, installing or installation in its name.
So better put your stuff there.

Mattias

I described in step #1:
Dir: c:\freepascal\binutils\i386-win32\
URL: http://svn.freepascal.org/svn/fpcbuild/branches/fixes_2_4/install/binw32

See http://wiki.freepascal.org/Installing_Lazarus#STEP_.231:_Create_directories It works, believe me... I use these scripts.

2nd: IIRC it isn't possible to install fpc in the same directory as the source. (I always create a subdirectory called "src" or "source")

If you got the FPC from the SVN, you can install anywhere.

The rest seem to be ok. Good work!

Thanks.

Regards,
MD

Ok, I'll try.

As I never installed a 64bit version before, I will delete the wince and x86_64 informations.
So, this tutorial is only for i386.

If Juha not finished clean/update yet, IMO is better he terminate first, right? After, he can move this tutorial or talk to me if he prefer...

MD

Marcos Douglas wrote

I described in step #1: Dir: c:\freepascal\binutils\i386-win32\ URL: http://svn.freepascal.org/svn/fpcbuild/branches/fixes_2_4/install/binw32

Just open this URL in your preferred browser and see there's no ppc386.exe. You'll have to copy it from somewhere.

If you got the FPC from the SVN, you can install anywhere.

You're right, I didn't knew that.

Ingo

2010/7/22 Marcos Douglas :

Just for info, if you need it. :)
My "Setup Cross Compile For ARM" tutorial starts from sources and compile Lazarus + FPC for i386-linux and arm-linux with an automated script.
Link: http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/Setup_Cross_Compile_For_ARM

Regards,
Kjow

You're right, I didn't see that :(
When I installed my FPC from SVN, I copied the ppc386.exe at the "Lazarus Installer".
So, where is the ppc386.exe in SVN, exists?

> If you got the FPC from the SVN, you can install anywhere. > You're right, I didn't knew that.

Thanks,
MD

Great job.
In the future, I will install FPC in Linux too.

Thanks,
MD

So, where is the ppc386.exe in SVN, exists?

Of course not. No binaries in SVN, only source, as it should be. Best is to install stable FPC and then compile the SVN version with it. After that replace the stable with your newly created version.

R.

Not so fast... here there are some binaries:
http://svn.freepascal.org/svn/fpcbuild/branches/fixes_2_4/install/binw32/

Best is to install stable FPC and then compile the SVN version with it. After that replace the stable with your newly created version.

So, is it mandatory to install one version of FPC (to get ppc386.exe) BEFORE get sources from SVN?!

MD

IMHO the Wiki should have a basic and short tutorial:
1. Download FPC binaries (linkWin32 - linkLinux - linkOthers)
2. Install FPC (current ie 2.4.0) via install.sh or exe (default /usr/bin or $ProgramFiles)
3. Download (link for basic sources) FPC sources
4. Uncompress the sources somewhere (take note)
5. Get Lazarus from SVN (svn co ....)
6. Compile with "make bigide" (to cover most cases)
7. If it fails (ie missing libs) show most common workarounds (X11, pixbuf, etc)

Not so fast... here there are some binaries: http://svn.freepascal.org/svn/fpcbuild/branches/fixes_2_4/install/binw32/

I really hope you know the difference between those binaries and ppc386.exe.

So, is it mandatory to install one version of FPC (to get ppc386.exe) BEFORE get sources from SVN?!

It's quite hard to compile pascal code without a pascal compiler.

R.

Disclaimer: I am not a Windows guy and don't know what a exe is, means or does. :)

You are absolutely correct, but missed some:

0.1 Sit in front of computer
0.2 Turn on computer and monitor
0.3 Wait
0.4 Enter Login and Password (sometimes optional)
0.5 Wait again
0.6 Find "Show-Internet-Thingy" and start it (sometimes called browser)

;)

And you really missed that the OP wants to compile FPC from SVN as well.

R.

Would be easy if we could download a ppc386 in some place...

MD

Marcos Douglas wrote

So, what do you want? Delete all information about wince and x86_64 or somebody will complete these informations?

i wouldn't delete them... i'm rather interested because i want/need to figure out how to cross compile for OS2 and linux...

while i totally agree, it still doesn't explain, that i can tell, where one can get the other compilers for the other platforms...

in other words, from a w2k box, if i grab the sources for i386-win and the sources for i386-linux and the sources for i386-OS2 and run the full compilation process, will i truly end up with the compilers for linux and OS2 such that cross compiling is now just a click or two away???

somehow, i don't think so... i may be wrong but no one has really been able to show an easy method of doing this :?

i think i see what you're saying but it brings the question of how to compile the SVN sources without a compiler and proper environment ;)

Reimar Grabowski wrote

Disclaimer: I am not a Windows guy and don't know what a exe is, means or does. :)

in the DOS/Win world, the extension traditionally denotes what the file can do... .exe and .com are executables... .com files are basically memory snaps and are/were some of the easiest to create... nowadays, everything is .exe because it must be loadable into certain areas of memory... i don't know of anyone that is creating .com files any more unless they are in a pure traditional DOS type environment...

there's a lot more to this story but this isn't the place for it and i'd have to really dig for more meaty info if it were desired ;)

FWIW: i used to create .com files via debug and certain special scripts all the time... one of the easiest was a reboot mechanism of only a couple of bytes... 4 bytes, IIRC... maybe 6... two separate ones for each type of booting desired on intel-oriented systems... one for a warm boot (no memory count and such) and the other for cold boot (complete initialization)...

and the others, too... i think that that's the real key to being able to set up a cross compiling environment... not just having those sources but also those necessary other platform compilers and they must be compiled in the manner necessary for the chosen build platform... in other words, they may not be called ppcwhatever.exe for the *nix platform... if they are, one must be very careful to grab the proper ones...

there's a lot more to this story but this isn't the place for it and i'd have to really dig for more meaty info if it were desired ;)

Very kind of you, but I know google, thanks.

R.

in other words, from a w2k box, if i grab the sources for i386-win and the sources for i386-linux and the sources for i386-OS2 and run the full compilation process, will i truly end up with the compilers for linux and OS2 such that cross compiling is now just a click or two away???

No, first you read the build faq. Then the wiki pages. Then you know what you are doing and compiling a cross-compiler is as easy as stealing a kids sweets. :)

R.

yeah, this day in time, uncle google may very well have the details... i still have stuff that i saved from similar discussions back in the '80s and '90s from the fidonet PASCAL and PASCAL_LESSONS echos ;)

I didn't find a starting compiler for windows, but for linux, darwin and freebsd you can get ppcxxx from
ftp://ftp.freepascal.org/pub/fpc/dist/2.4.0/bootstrap/

read it...

Then the wiki pages.

them too, when i finally found them...

Then you know what you are doing

is that a requirement? especially when one simply wants to write a program ("hello world" for instance) and compile it for each of the available platforms ;)

and compiling a cross-compiler is as easy as stealing a kids sweets. :)

/me thinks that swiping sweets is much easier :lol:

> Then you know what you are doing is that a requirement? especially when one simply wants to write a program ("hello world" for instance) and compile it for each of the available platforms ;)

Understanding is always a requirement. If you want "hello world" on many platforms and building a FPC cross-compiler is to complex, then perhaps you have the wrong tool for the job. Chances are that no compiled language is needed ("hello world is not CPU intensive") and you could try Java, Python, Perl, etc. Choose the right tool for the job. :)

If you want to do it, because you 'love' pascal, then show your dedication by learning the stuff needed. I am sure the people on the FPC list will help you, if you have any troubles.

R.

and here i thought that you were bright enough to understand that "hello world" was an example :?

yes, i understand what you are saying however, remember that the point i'm coming from is from that of the "average joe coder" who has no need of understanding all the deep intricacies of everything... they only want to simply and easily set up their environment so that they can "write once and compile everywhere" even if that means compiling for platforms that they don't even have access to ;)

You mean like ftp://ftp.freepascal.org/pub/fpc/dist/2.4.0/bootstrap/ ?

Julio C. Taborda wrote

I didn't find a starting compiler for windows, but for linux, darwin and freebsd you can get ppcxxx from ftp://ftp.freepascal.org/pub/fpc/dist/2.4.0/bootstrap/

I added win32.

Hi!

Every i386-win32 compiler is also an i386-linux and an i386-os2 compiler (and other i386 targets as well). But to compile an application for another system than the current one (e.g. win32 -> linux) you have some requirements:

1) You need the binutils for the target system (e.g. an ELF-linker for Linux if you're compiling from Windows)
2) You need to build the RTL for the target
In FPC src dir you do it like this:
make all OS_TARGET=linux CPU_TARGET=i386
CROSSBINDIR=c:\your\dir\with\linux\binutils BINUTILSPREFIX=i386-linux- The BINUTILSPREFIX is the part of the binary names of the binutils before the e.g. "ld" or "as". It's (as well as CROSSBINDIR) needed for the compiler to pick the correct binutils
You can then install the RTL into the same directory as your normal win32 RTL:
make crossinstall OS_TARGET=linux CPU_TARGET=i386
INSTALL_PREFIX=c:\where\you\installed\i386-win32\
3) To compile a more complex program you also need the libraries that are used on the target system like "ld-linux", "libc", "libmysqlclient", "libgtk" etc.

Please note: if you cross compile from a i386 target excluding win32 to win32 you need neither step 1 (because FPC contains an internal linker) nor step 3 (because that's not needed on Windows platforms including Win64 and WinCE).

To compile a cross compiler for a different platform (e.g. arm) you need the following:
1) Binutils for your target platform
2) You need to compile with CPU_TARGET=arm and the appropiate system (e.g. OS_TARGET=wince or OS_TARGET=linux) the rest is like 2) above
3) same as above

Regards,
Sven

yes, i understand what you are saying however, remember that the point i'm coming from is from that of the "average joe coder" who has no need of understanding all the deep intricacies of everything...

Now seriously.
There are many much smarter people on this list than me. I am doing pascal coding only as a hobby. I don't have any programming/computer related degree. I don't understand all and everything of building a cross-compiler, but it only took me about 2 hours from not knowing where to start to a working cross-compiler. If that is to much for "average joe coder" then perhaps "average joe coder" should really switch to something like Java. Building a cross-compiler is not that hard. It takes some dedication and time. But it looks likes people are just lazy. Don't want to know, don't want to learn, always crying: "Give me the ready made stuff!" To me this sounds like the attitude of an end user and not that of a coder. No offence ment, but I really don't get it. We are coders after all. Learning and understanding makes a great part of this. Even learning stuff that you maybe don't need that often or ever again. Anyone interested in my CP/M knowledge? No? Thought so. Again, I don't believe that I am much smarter than "joe". So if I can do it, he can do it, too. I really don't want to offend anyone, I just don't understand this attitude. If you call yourself a coder, regardless of skill, setting up your environment is your task. And you have documentation and a great community that helps. What do you need more? Yes, sometimes it sucks, that things are a little complicated but such is life.

R.

I really agree with this. Programmers should be able to feed themselves, not relying on others to spoon-feed them. If people don't want to learn, perhaps they shouldn't be programmers in the first place.

Henry

I agree.

MD

As Win too! Look
ftp://ftp.freepascal.org/pub/fpc/dist/2.4.0/bootstrap/ppc386-win32.zip Is this (important) information in somewhere (wiki, docs, etc)?

MD

I read now... thanks!
I will change the tuturial...

MD

About waldo said, I understood that:
This things not need to be so hard, because they aren't. For example, do not had a ppc386 for Windows in FTP, but now has (thanks Marco). Now, we have a ppc386 for Windows, the compilation is easy and will be more easy to test FPC, eg. a "Hello world".

MD

Marcos Douglas wrote torstai, 22. hein?kuuta 2010 20:09:54:

Please feel free to continue your work.
I improved the Getting Lazarus page but I am not really happy with the results. There are two wiki pages, or three including yours, and a BuildFAQ about getting and installing Lazarus and FPC, and then the big FPC manuals.

My purpose was to make something short and concentrated for people (like me) who just want to get it done and not read a long detailed manual. The task is difficult because there are so many combinations. Getting release Lazarus for Windows, Mac, Ubuntu Linux, Redhat lLinux etc... Getting svn trunk Lazarus for Windows, Mac, Ubuntu Linux, Redhat lLinux etc., using different SVN clients. Getting those SVN clients. Using those SVN clients etc...
Then there is getting and installing FPC using different methods, which really doesn't belong to Getting Lazarus page.

The problem with wiki pages is that people add detailed info there but don't or can't organize the whole page structure. Like on Getting Lazarus, instructions for getting SVN trunk version are pretty simple. Then somebody (with good intentions) added long instructions, onto the same page, about how to use TortoiseSVN on Windows. Then somebody (again with good intentions) added his long Windows CMD scrips to automate tasks. They are not needed for most people.
As a result the page became very long and the relevant information was very difficult to find. Other wiki pages have the same problem.

I separated some OS / platform specific sections to their own sub-pages. Later I started to think it would be better to make many complete pages each for one platform only. They would contain partly duplicated info but it would all be relevant to the person who reads the page.
Like:
Getting and installing Lazarus for Windows
Getting and installing Lazarus for Mac
Getting and installing Lazarus for Linux (maybe separate pages for Ubuntu and some other distros)

would cover release and svn versions of Lazarus for only one platform / page. And the same thing for FPC:

Getting and installing FPC for Windows
Getting and installing FPC for Mac
Getting and installing FPC for Linux

It is important not to pollute the pages with some seldom needed details. There can be other comprehensive manuals for that.

Marcos Douglas: if you have vision and energy you could make a bigger revamp with these download/install pages, not just adding one more page there.

Regards.
Juha

Juha Manninen wrote

As a result the page became very long and the relevant information was very difficult to find. Other wiki pages have the same problem.

now you know one of my main reasons for not liking wiki pages at all... here's another...

if a wiki is supposed to be like a book or encyclopedia, where's the table of contents like a real print and paper book has at its beginning? it should be right there on the very first page when one first goes to the wiki... and another...

if a wiki is supposed to be like a book or encyclopedia, where's the index of content keywords like a real print and paper book has at its end? it should be right there and easily accessible from the first page when one first goes to the wiki...

i'm not talking about the above to be manually built... it should be part of the wiki software... who thinks of these things and then leaves out such important parts?? :?

i, for one, thank you for your work on straightening things out... i've attempted to a few times but never really get too far... mainly due to confusion and lack of knowledge... i think the only real things that i've done in the wiki so far have been spelling and grammatical corrections...

On Fri, 23 Jul 2010 13:14:54 -0400, waldo kitty

table

of contents like a real print and paper book has at its beginning? it

should

be right there on the very first page when one first goes to the wiki...

and

index

goes

to the wiki...

You mean something like this?

http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php?title=Special:Allpages&from=&namespace=0

It's even named "index" btw, although it's more like a cross-over between

TOC and Index.

It will be in the next version of the buildfaq. But keep in mind that this is only for devels that know what they are doing. The formal stand is to install the previous release, and that remains that way. Specially on windows/dos, where the release is not just about the compiler, but also having the most recently approved binutils.

I agree with you.
As I written at the first time in this wiki, I preferred not to change anything, even if I thought something should be changed.

I did. I added 2 Windows CMD scripts to compile FPC and Lazarus. But are 2 small scripts. They just change PATH and call make. This is more simple than change PATH in ' Windows System Properties', I think.

I agree. But compiling the source from the SVN can not be so simple for most people. So I think in this case (using SVN) the information should be detailed and, if possible, automate tasks using scripts.

Marcos Douglas: if you have vision and energy you could make a bigger revamp with these download/install pages, not just adding one more page there.

I have the energy. But I'm a little time in the community. Is that if I start changing the documentation, the oldest will give me an earful? I don't know... but if I have support, I continue. Another problem is: I think my English is not so good :(

Regards. Juha

Thanks Juha.
MD

Marcos Douglas wrote lauantai, 24. hein?kuuta 2010 19:14:24:

I agree. But compiling the source from the SVN can not be so simple for most people. So I think in this case (using SVN) the information should be detailed and, if possible, automate tasks using scripts.

It is easy when you leave the extra fillings out. For example Lazarus trunk for Linux is essentially:

$ svn co http://svn.freepascal.org/svn/lazarus/trunk lazarus
$ cd lazarus
$ make all

Yes!
And it is not much more difficult in Windows, with or without the CMD scripts.

Building and installing the FPC trunk was supposed to be difficult. I experimented and searched for information for long before I got it right. But finally it is very easy. For Linux again it is a very short wiki section: http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/Getting_Lazarus#Build_and_install_with_make

Sorry, only now I understood that you improved the old installation page which was badly outdated. It is better now but still it is long and intimidating for a new user. The download / installation pages are quite critical because they are the first thing a new person looks for.
Now those potential users get a "Uhhh, so difficult!" effect from the long pages.
If the instructions are divided into short pages with only one version and one platform / page, someone could get a "Wow, so easy!" effect. (maybe).

I know, it would require many pages but IMO that is OK. They would be linked from a central Download / Installation page which would be linked from many visible places in wiki.

I have the energy. But I'm a little time in the community. Is that if I start changing the documentation, the oldest will give me an earful? I don't know... but if I have support, I continue. Another problem is: I think my English is not so good :(

To me your English looks good.
I think many people realize that the documentation is not perfect and would be happy about the improvements.
The old pages can be removed later when the new ones are good enough.

BTW, how to remove a wiki page?

Juha

Andreas Schneider wrote perjantai, 23. hein?kuuta 2010 23:26:20:

I answered this yesterday from my new IMAP configured gmail address but it somehow evaporated...

The problem with wiki is that there is no structure information available. Thus automatic TOC is not possible.
The "index" is only a list of page names, all sharing the same name space, without information about where each page is linked.

For this reason wiki does not suit well for big documentation projects. At least there should be a "editor-in-chief" taking care of the structure.

There must be something between wikis and the heavy document management system (DMS). I haven't studied the topic much.

Regards,
Juha

When I joined the community of FPC, I tried to compile the FPC / Laz on my PC, but could not. After receiving some tips in mailing-list, I joined them and put all in this tutorial.
Now, this is not so difficult for me, but in the beginning was, because of the details. What is ppc386, PPC_CONFIG_PATH variable, etc. I only learned about it on the mailing-list.

I agree. So, let's go improve it?

Thanks. Then this is not a problem any more.

The old pages can be removed later when the new ones are good enough. BTW, how to remove a wiki page?

I don't know... I never try! =)

MD

Marcos Douglas kirjoitti lauantai, 24. hein?kuuta 2010 22:40:06:

Those must be more like advanced features. At least I have never set PPC_CONFIG_PATH variable and I have a working FPC 2.5.1 trunk version here. I recently even tested my own instructions on a mini-laptop with Linux and they seem to work well.

The pages should have the shortest possible way to make it work first and then an advanced section in the end if needed.

I agree. So, let's go improve it?

I can make and check the Linux instructions if you get a new structure for the pages.

Juha

Juha Manninen wrote

Those must be more like advanced features. At least I have never set PPC_CONFIG_PATH variable and I have a working FPC 2.5.1 trunk version here. I recently even tested my own instructions on a mini-laptop with Linux and they seem to work well.

You right, the PPC_CONFIG_PATH variable is not mandatory.

The pages should have the shortest possible way to make it work first and then an advanced section in the end if needed.

I agree.

> I agree. So, let's go improve it? I can make and check the Linux instructions if you get a new structure for the pages.

Okay... but I thought you had already started, haven't you? If you have some news ideas, tell me and let's go to work... if not, I will think how will be the new struct.

MD

Okay... but I thought you had already started, haven't you? If you have some news ideas, tell me and let's go to work... if not, I will think how will be the new struct.

I started in a different way. I made small sub-pages linked into the main instruction page. Then I realized it is not so good. It will always be messy trying to fit all the variations there, even if there are links to sub-pages.

Juha
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2010/7/26 Juha Manninen :

Would you like to talk in private about some ideas to organize the wiki? (but, if somebody has any ideas about it, we still continue to talk here)

MD

Marcos Douglas kirjoitti maanantai, 26. hein?kuuta 2010 20:43:44:

Would you like to talk in private about some ideas to organize the wiki? (but, if somebody has any ideas about it, we still continue to talk here)

You can contact me with with e-mail or with chat. I try to keep my chat client open and logged to #lazarus-ide.

Juha

Ok. I will think about how improvement the wiki installation, so as you... and we help us.

Thanks,
MD

Ok. I will think about how improvement the wiki installation, so as you... and we help us.

Thanks,
MD

dear coleagues:

i am using fpc 2.2.3 and lazarus 0.9.27 and i have suffered a lot of electrical blockade in this days.

i try to instal tdbf to see one of the samples of lazreport, but i can't

i have the .exe for installer, but i want to know if i have to uninstal first and re install or i can install over the prior installation.

thanks in advance, and if you can furnish me and address to download a young version, (not forgesource) i will appreciate very much.

yours,

Ing. H?ctor F. Fiandor Rosario

20.08.2010 1:28, hector fiandor ?????:

Why? What is the error message?

i have the .exe for installer, but i want to know if i have to uninstal first and re install or i can install over the prior installation.

I would recommend to uninstall previous version first.

thanks in advance, and if you can furnish me and address to download a young version, (not forgesource) i will appreciate very much.

You can take snapshot from http://www.hu.freepascal.org/lazarus/ (I would recommend Lazarus 0.9.28.3 with FPC 2.4.0). You can download sources there too. You can also use SVN to download sources.

20.08.2010 4:31, hector fiandor ?????:

Your hardware is at fault probably.

i deduce that the problem is in any lazarus file damaged with an electrical interruption and i suppose that a new installation can solve the problem, althougt i will need to install the LazReport in addition to the Tdfb

It won't harm. You should also check your hardware.

[snip] thanks in advance for your message. I will need to get in contact with a LazReport?expert to give "an air" to Jesus Reyes, who have helped me

a lot.